I have recently been given the privilege to get into the inner workings and mind of WORLD FAMOUS guitarist ZIM ZUM! As you all know, Zim Zum is the ex-guitarist of the band MARILYN MANSON and co-wrote many songs for the MECHANICAL ANIMALS album in his time with the band. MOST IMPORTANTLY, Zim talks to me much about his NEW band, THE POP CULTURE SUICIDES and the recordings THEY are making. He allowed me to venture through some of his personal life including where he grew up and jobs he has had before being a professional musician.

ZIM ZUM is a very egoless, artistic and influential person. This interview also includes subjects that Zim does not like to talk about much but opened up to me.....

Hello, Zim Zum. I want to start out by getting the exact origin of your name. I have heard that it fell into pattern with the rest of the members of MARILYN MANSON, which was first name named after a female model, which in your case would be the 1940s pin up model ZIM KRAMER, and last name named after a serial killer, which in your case would have been the 1970s serial killer RAYMOND ZUM. I have also heard Zim Zum came from the HEBREW belief of ZIM ZUM being the angel who was doing Gods dirty work. The final origin of the name would be from the CABBALAH belief of TZIM-TZUM which, if I am not mistaken, translates to God setting limitations on himself for the better of what he has created. Which of these is the true origin of your name and how did you come up with the name for yourself?

It was derived from the Cabbalah and the actual meaning is: In Cabbalah, "Tzim-Tzum" is the contrast of absolute unity in the context of complete wholeness. Cabbalah teaches that creation continuously unfolds from the "Tzim-Tzum" process. The hidden transcendent Absolute, Deus Absconditus had to contract itself to produce the place for the creation. If En-Sof is everything, if It is unlimited and endless, here there is no "space" for the created universe. Therefore En-Sof, or Unlimited Light contracted from the center to "empty" a place for the world. The technical term for this contraction is "ZimZum" (tzimtzum). ZimZum is interpreted as God's self-limitation for the benefit of the creation. The name wasnt based on the serial killer thing. It wasn't until after the fact that someone found 2 names that would connect it to a pin up and a serial killer.

Before getting deeper into your professional background, which obviously includes being an ex member of MARILYN MANSON, your current project, THE POP CULTURE SUICIDES and PLEISTOSCENE, I want to get more into the life and mind of Zim Zum. You were born and raised in Chicago, Illinois, right? How was that?

Yes, it was actually a very, very tiny suburb just on the other side of Harlem Ave from Chicago but most of my time was spent in Chicago and I was born in Chicago. Looking back I wouldn't change a thing about where I grew up. It seemed so small and distant from the rest of the planet but as it turns out, you don't have to be a product of your environment. I was raised by my Grandmother who was thee personification of every good quality. She was very intelligent, kind, encouraging, patient and understanding and is the underlying element in all that I do. I had small group good friends (hell raisers) that I am still in touch with now.

Did you have siblings growing up and do you have family still in Chicago?

I have one older brother and he lives just outside Chicago.

What type of "group" were you in during your school years?

I guess it depends on when as far as my personal timeline. I was artsy and then that morphed into being a musician, so having said that, you can guess that I wasn't in the in crowd but I also wasn't in the out crowd either.

Cliques are a joke anyways, in my opinion. At what age did you pick up the guitar and start learning to play and who were your influences?

I heard 2 albums when I was 13 and they were Pink Floyd's "Dark Side of The Moon" and David Bowie's "Ziggy Stardust and The Spiders from Mars" that moment changed everything for me. My brother got a bass and I got a guitar that Christmas. To this day, those are still the biggest influences on what I do as a musician and a songwriter.

Those are with a doubt two amazing albums! Who was your first band and what type of music did you play?

I was lucky enough to start playing in a band almost immediately after getting a guitar, the lucky part was that my friends in the band also got instruments at the same time and they got different instruments than me.

Talk about perfect timing!

I also immediately shunned learning a lot of other peoples music and instead took pieces that I liked and figured out how to play them, never focusing on any one style specifically, I sort of bastardized everything I heard until I started to learn theory. From that point on I started writing my own music. The first real band I started when I was 16 and it was an original band. I played my first live show when I was 17 even though no one in the band was old enough to get into the club.

Wow, that's awesome! Young guys sneaking into a club under age to rock the crowd! Very cool. Besides being a musician, what other jobs have you had before you became a rocker and what was the worst one?

I've had some shitty jobs. The thing that really made them shitty was the way the people in charge were always assholes. I was a janitor, cleaning office buildings for a while and then got a job at a guitar company tuning guitars which lead to building guitars and working on Artist guitars; like the first Dime Bag signature guitar -as in THEE VERY FIRST ONE!

That is something so amazing you will never forget! What other musicians guitars have you worked on?

Guitars for Jimmy Page and Robert Plant, Gatemouth Brown, Steve Stevens, Ted Nugent and Nuno Bettencourt.

What was the last job you had before you joined MANSON?

Before I joined Manson I was collecting unemployment....I actually had to pay my phone bill to get it turned back on just in case they called after I sent in a demo.

Well, since we brought up Manson we might as well get on the subject if you are not/opposed to it?!

I am almost always opposed to these questions as it was such a small part of my life with a big impact and I have since moved on to a place that is not only very different but much better. It is really about the question rather than the time. I'm always much more open to talking guitars of TPCS or horror movies but I'll answer a few...

Awesome! Before joining MARILYN MANSON did you ever listen to the band or were you ever into them at all?

I had a friend who was into them and told me I should check them out simply based on the fact that he said the singer was shoving bottles up his ass. I did see them once, though from the back of a crowded venue. It was shortly after that, that I saw an ad in a local artsy newspaper that said "Marilyn Manson seeks Guitarist" but I didn't own any of the CD's until I got the call about coming to an audition.

You joined MM in 1996, replacing DAISY BERKOWITZ, and began playing live on the DEAD TO THE WORLD tour. What consisted of the audition and how did it feel being the man chosen to be in the band out of all who auditioned for the part?

Looking back on the audition I was the one that was least trying to play the part of what the other people auditioning thought the band wanted. That says quite a bit about the cliche' of just being yourself. I had told one of my friends after sending in an audition demo that if I got the call back, the gig was mine. Simply because the chance of getting heard in the stereotypical "pile of demos" was so slim that if they heard my demo, I was in. I sent in 4 original songs that I really liked and showed that I had a specific style but one that could cross quite a few genre's. It was nice to get the gig based on what I was, not by trying to be something I wasn't.

That's cool that you didn't sell out who you were and still got the gig! The first video we can see you in for MM was "THE BEAUTIFUL PEOPLE." I heard something about you not having any guitar picks for the shoot and that you had to use a CANADIAN LOONIE, which is the Canadian dollar, for a pick...is this true?

Yes, that is true. All I took to the video shoot was my guitar. Unfortunately my tech forgot to put some picks in the case so I had to use a Canadian coin. Being more abrasive than a guitar pick it ate my strings to the point where they were sharp thus cutting my hand open. You can also see in that video that the shirt I had on was one piece, in that it included the hands in the arms of the shirt so once you were in that shirt, you were IN that shirt and after shooting the song about 6 times my hand was bleeding and the blood was drying and the shirt dried into it. So, you can see in one part, my individual section, where I am trying to pull the shirt from the blood and the look of pain.

I saw MM live twice while you were in the band and I saw a lot of crazy stuff happening on stage from MANSON's self mutilations to extremely destructive behavior on stage which caused injuries to members on stage. I know on your first gig with MM in NYC at the NOTHING NIGHT SHOWCASE on Sept. 5th, 1996 GINGER FISH was put into the hospital due to Marilyn swinging his mic stand and breaking Gingers ribs! Did you ever get injured from this behavior at all?

I remain unscarred from that entire tour. In the moment destruction and violence is one thing, going to the hospital is another. There was a very fine line there. As crazy as the show was and everything that was going on outside the venue, on TV, in the press, the religious fanatics, the socio political censorship backlash and all the death threats and bomb threats, I don't think I was any different from anyone that came to the concerts in that it was the one place where I could be myself and feel safe.

Well thats good you have no battle wounds from the experience. I feel the same as far as being yourself and safe at a concert, if you cant be who you are whether you are performing or attending a concert then it takes a lot away from even being there.
Most every band has a real bad horror story of something that happened either on the road or in the studio or during a performance, would you like to share one with me?

I don't really have any horror stories, it was one big horror story in a good way. There were mobs of fans in other countries that I thought were going to flip the vehicle we were in over or pull my arms off. There were "Beatle-esque" moments where I found myself running down a street away from large groups of fans. Not being able to stand by the window of my hotel room because of a death threat is always weird. Having 2 security guards around Halloween, one always in front of me and one always behind me, was weird. The general "threat" was always weird and amusing at the same time as I thought if I was going to go out I was going to go out with a guitar. There were people that really loved the band and understood what we were doing but the opposite of that was that there were people that really hated the band and would do anything to stop it, there were so many more things that made that point in time, perfect. I played my guitar all over the planet for millions of people. The tour, the albums, it was all just perfect timing and being ready when the time comes. There are people who play guitar now because of me and if they love doing it half as much as I do then I couldn't imagine having a better influence on people. I cant help but feel I am lucky to be me.

I remember your influence on me when I was younger! It is very strange to actually be able to have conversations with you now after that. Anyways, after being in the band for awhile did you listen to the music more? Do you like to listen to yourself play on any of the recordings you did while in MM?

I learned just about every song just after I joined the band, even the remix versions. I had one of the rooms at Trent's studio to myself where I had a boombox that I learned the songs on. I wanted to be able to play anything at any time because that's who I am not because I was the (first) "new guitarist "It was a lot of live shows. I didn't have any time to really listen to anything. I was never told at any point to play things identical to the disc either tonally or structurally. I'm a different person and I bring a different swagger to what I play. I kept it to the note but with guitar solo's and things like that it was always going to sound like me regardless of what I was playing. I never felt I was replacing anyone. I never cared if anyone liked my guitar playing because at the end of every day, I did. I don't listen to any of the recordings that I am on, though it never gets old hearing them on the radio...

I find MECHANICAL ANIMALS to be my favorite Manson CD to be quite honest with you. You wrote some of the songs on MECHANICAL ANIMALS, right?

Yes, I am all over that album and I am extremely proud of that album.

As you should be! What songs did you bring into the band and after leaving the band in 1998, how did you feel seeing JOHN 5 who replaced your duties in the band and played the songs you help write and bring them to life live in concert?

My contributions were easy for me. I just played what I felt. I had 1,000's of ideas and would travel with a mini recorder and record every idea I had. I would randomly leave it play in one of the rooms in Manson's house/the studio so it would always be in the background and my ideas and my style just bled into the band and that album. I was always with my guitar playing somewhere in that house. The writing of that album was one of my favorite times in the band. I have never heard anyone else play the MA songs.

Have you listened to anything MM has done since you left the band?

No. (I have no idea who is in the band)

I think it is quite unclear for everyone to know who is in it at this point! During the period of time you were in MM, who was your favorite band you toured with?

Pantera, Black Sabbath. It just doesn't get any better than that.

How great that had to have been! Now, besides your time spent with MM, you have had other projects you have been a part of. Two that come to mind is PLEISTOSCENE and THE POP CULTURE SUICIDES. Before we get to TPCS, I would like to know where the name PLEISTOSCENE came from and what, if anything, is going on with that project?

The Pleistoscene explanation is such a long one that I will leave that up to Google searches and interpretations for the details but it was a period in time where man was freezing in an ice age, everything was dying off, yet it was also the time when the earliest evidence of art was discovered. The balance between extreme conditions, death and art is very interesting.

Very interesting and they go hand in hand on many levels. Is the project still productive?

Pleistoscene is as functional as ever and it is what it has always been just in a more defined way. It has always been me, my outlet to explore music without boundaries, be it soundscapes, soundtrack type material or a warped somewhat reverse take on the things I do. I've written and recorded a lot of Pleistoscene music and I will continue to release the music randomly.

Your main project right now is THE POP CULTURE SUICIDES. I have seen you guys live and I loved the music, the look and the performance. How did you get together with AJAX, TREY, BARON and HAZE LEE FINN?

Ajax was first. He was a guitar player when I met him. I actually thought he was a bit of a stalker when I met him as he came up to me while I was still in Manson and actually with Manson at a book party at a club in Chicago. He came up to me with the stereotypical line of "I know your cousin" which isn't very specific and tends to come off a bit stalker-rish. Anyway, fast forward a bit and he approached me about being the keyboard player in the band and he handled it perfectly. Ajax recommended a couple singers, as I was going through no less than 100s of auditions, and the one that he thought might work I had actually said wouldn't work at least 3 different times. After an audition or 2, Finn did work and work perfectly and has been with me ever since. Finn suggested a bass player, as I had already gone through a few of them, and that bass player was Trey. Though there is a theme here, Trey is a perfect fit. Baron saw an ad I had placed in the paper looking for a drummer and was rehearsing in the same building we were. His timing was perfect as we had been auditioning drummers that talked the part but simply couldn't play the songs and it was driving me nuts to sit through those auditions. there hasn't been anyone who has come in to a first audition and nailed the songs, the songs are not easy. Baron came really close and his way of playing, dedication to the drums and his charming personality, not to mention his love of horror movies, is a perfect fit. As a band I get along with all of the guys better than any band I have ever been in and it is not an easy thing to find 5 different people who, when combined are always on the same page. Everyone knows that we are coming from a place musically that some people might not get because they have grown accustomed to hearing things that are "easy" or not based in any real emotion so the dedication to what we do as a collective is always 110%.

It seems as if you guys fell very nicely into place with one another. TPCS are in the studio and recording and what I have heard so far on your MySpace page sounds amazing! Is there one main writer of the music or does everyone write together?

Thanks and yes, it is a perpetual recording process as I tend to write all the time regardless of what else is going on like live shows or rehearsals. Everything I write is very "journal-esque" in that it is based on raw emotion and reality, always being very personal.

Thats very important to me because you can FEEL that the music is real.

I have a very clear vision of what The Pop Culture Suicides is and it is based on a rock opera that I have been working on for quite a while. I write and record everything and Finn comes in and records the vocals.

On TPCS MySpace page, your song, THE ART OF THE BRUISE, has the most hits on it from listeners. I love the song but for me APOCALYPTIC LOVE SONG is hypnotizing. What was the inspiration for the music and lyrics of these two songs?

Again, both come from a personal place, my life, what I see, what I know and what I am trying to understand as all the songs do. Both songs are very different theme's. All of the songs are left to interpretation. That's the art in it as everyone that hears the songs will hear it in a different way and relate to it in a different way. The Art of The Bruise is has a lot to do with not giving up, no matter what the situation is or what society dictates you should do. Apocalyptic Love Song is pretty clear in it's approach. Living with the regret of not telling someone how you feel makes living very hard when they are no longer here to hear it or they are here but days pass that we will never get back again. Life is short and our time together is limited, dont be afraid to say what you feel.

What has become your favorite SUICIDES song?

It's always the newest one, there are about 50 songs the general public hasn't heard so I dont want to say a bunch of songs that no one has heard because I will get tons of e-mails asking about those songs. I personally like them all and they are all I listen to, the only CD's in my car, the only music on my stereo. Each one has something different to say, each comes from a different place stylistically and I will continue to confuse people that try to put a tag on what we do as I dont have any boundaries when writing so I am never working within a box.

Do you feel like you have more freedom with TPCS than when you were with MM?

That is the easiest question ever. Yes. The thing is that people that come to the shows to hear the music think that there is going to be something to connect what I have done with what I am doing. The only connection is me as a person, not me as a songwriter.

How far along is your recording with TPCS at this point? When can we expect a release for the album and what will it be called?

There are at least 3 albums worth of music and I would personally like to see 3 double albums released. There will be an EP released that is somewhat of a trailer for the album to come, int he same way you see a trailer for a movie. The EP is being mixed now and the release should either be in December or early next year. It is tentatively titled "Anti Social Pep Rally"

Thats a great name. A definite attention grabber! Do you guys have plans to keep TPCS an underground band or breakthrough to the mainstream?

I like where we are knowing where it can go. We will always be an underground band compared to what is out there now. There are no preconceived notions about where the music belongs. We simply do what we do on a very intimate basis though we have very lofty goals for where this will all be. I still believe I can change the world.

Do you have any trust issues with the way the industry is today?

I don't really have any issues with the industry as I approach what I do as my own industry. I've been around. I don't need anyone telling me how I should be marketing what I do or having any kind of artistic control over what I do. If there is a place for The Pop Culture Suicides in the industry as it is right now, that remains to be seen but getting the message out to everyone is something we are more than capable of doing on our own.

How do you feel when you see television and music charts filled with nothing but lip syncing pop artist and rappers ruling over a lot of real rock bands?

What is in today wont be in tomorrow because there is no longevity in the "product" that is being force fed to everyone now. It's not just an industry problem, if you support that music then you are to blame as well. You have to support the music you love and give the finger to whoever is pushing the same old shit, because there are too many musicians out there in great bands that don't fit into the formulaic mold that is mainstream that you will never hear because what you are hearing is what you are being allowed to hear because it ties into some related product or relates to "units sold".

Thats unfortunate but is absolutely true! What is in your CD player or MP3 player right now?

TPCS!

Current favorite band?

TPCS, or Black Sabbath.

What is your favorite show you have ever played and your favorite show you ever seen from someone else?

Both of those come from the same tour. That would be Ozzfest 97 with Pantera and Black Sabbath. Playing in between those 2 bands is just something I cant even begin to explain. Both Dime and Tony (Iommi) were the nicest, most giving people I have ever met and it is nothing less than a true honor to have shared a stage with both of them (literally with Dime as he cam on stage almost every night during our set)

That would be a complete dream come true! Again, something you will never be able to forget! Lets talk guilty pleasure! Movie? TV show? Band or singer? Song?

Music- anything by REO Speedwagon, I don't even consider that a guilty pleasure.

Any other guilty pleasures you'd care to share?

Popcorn and peanut m&m's (at the same time)

What can we expect from you next?

The unexpected, of course.....

Zim it has been nothing but an absolute pleasure to be able to talk with you! I thank you sincerely and I am looking forward to any CD release TPCS make in the future! LONG LIVE THE SUICIDES!

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